May 26, 2022

Season 6 Halftime Show

Season 6 Halftime Show

In Episode 83, Paul and Phil discuss highlights and lessons learned from our interviews with Dr. Daniel O’Neill, Cara Bradley, Evan Dabby, and Brad Miller during the first half of this season, a milestone reached by the podcast, and the wild finish...

In Episode 83, Paul and Phil discuss highlights and lessons learned from our interviews with Dr. Daniel O’Neill, Cara Bradley, Evan Dabby, and Brad Miller during the first half of this season, a milestone reached by the podcast, and the wild finish to the English Premier League this past weekend. They also give a quick preview of what’s to come in the second half of Season 6 and reveal whether Paul will conduct any more interviews with Phil in the future.

Resources and Links from this Episode


Phil: Welcome back to how soccer explains leadership. Thanks again for being a part of this show. And uh, you know, we are entering into a, another half-time show, which Paul and I love getting to do. I, of course don't want to speak for Paul. So Paul, do you love getting to do

[00:00:15] Paul: this? I love it. I love it. I mean, this was a little bit different seasons because I got to chime in on, on one of the episodes, but usually this is my only time to kind of chime in and talk.

But yeah, man, I love these check-ins here.

[00:00:27] Phil: Yeah. So, you know, we, we love doing this because we get to just kind of reminisce about the great half of a season that we were just able to have. I'm Phil Darke for those of you. If this is your first time listening to the podcast, welcome, and we are your hosts.

We get to usually just interview amazing people which this season has been no exception. And then every, so often we just get together and talk about what we, what we talked about and to, to be able to just talk about a few other things as well. And, and today is actually, we are recording this the week that we're [00:01:00] releasing it, which isn't the typical way we do these things, but we are this weekend and just yesterday was the final day of the premier league.

And normally we don't talk about just the world of soccer per se. In this podcast, we talk about what soccer is teaching us about life and leadership. I got to bring that up yesterday. Cause it was just an amazing finish. And you, and you were saying you got to kind of follow it via text at the soccer field cause you were with one of your sons watching some, some soccer, but, but what what'd you get from the text world of that?

Just while that ride we re we got to, got to be a part of it.


[00:01:36] Paul: to put it in perspective, man, I think you need to know that, you know, the text messages were coming from my nephew who is a Liverpool fan. So it was coming from the Liverpool perspective, but just crazy the back and forth. And you know, everybody's talking about the top of the table, which we always do, but I think there's a lot of conversation about the bottom of the table was almost just as crazy as the top.

Yeah, what a wild ride. And I think as we were saying before, we started recording and that's why we love this [00:02:00] game, you know, it's just it's unpredictable. You never know. And I personally think that, you know, I wish every season ended that dramatically. It just keeps it so interesting all the way to the end of it.

You know, there's been seasons where you've had the leader who had clenched, you know, weeks ahead of time or whatever, but this is, I think a lot more fun as it comes down to the.

[00:02:21] Phil: Yeah. I mean, it literally went down to the last 15 minutes and she's, I mean, it was, it was, I think at the last 10 minutes of both the games, they.

It was, it was tied. And so it was effectively zero, zero going into last 10 minutes so that the title race came down to that the relegation battle came down to the last 10, 15 minutes. It wasn't. Could have switched everything up until the last 10, 15 minutes of the season, which is unbelievable. I mean, and even going to the Europa you know, I, I say that only because Manchester United backed into the Europa league, which is, I [00:03:00] mean, if that's not a Testament to where they are right now, I don't know uh, what would be, but the fact that West Ham had to lose to Brighton and I didn't, I haven't been a brightened supporter for forever.

And was yesterday for a bit. And. And then the champions league spot as well. I mean, Tottenham had to beat, had to beat Norwich. I mean, which Norwich was already long gone into the, into the championship, but, but to have every, literally every spot was at stake yesterday, which I don't remember a season.

That has been that way with the, with the, now

[00:03:35] Paul: there was a lot on the line. I think it was even really interesting the weekend prior, you know, as, as things were kind of building up to, Hey, what, what is the last weekend gonna look like? You know, I got to watch, you know, some of those matches but that was even an interesting weekend too, because it really set up such a dramatic.

Those results were so important because it set up such a dramatic last, last day for, for the league and for all the different leagues and all the circumstances and everything that falls into place and the amount of money that [00:04:00] probably went back and forth. Not, I'm not talking about the betting side of it, cause I'm sure there's a lot of money to change hands for the betting side, but just within, within the, you know, promotion relegation side of finances for leagues and players contracts.

And I mean, I think people forget that. No, the domino effect that those results actually have for people's lives, you know, front office, staff, players, players within teams and organizations and, stadium buildings, and, things like that. I mean, I just came back from a trip and talking to some of the folks there that you promoted from a second division to a first division there's, you know, stadium requirements and all these things that, that people don't even think about.

But. I love thinking through those processes of like your case, not just about the teams that stayed up and the teams that went down, but all the different pieces that have to fall that fall into place after that happens. But I'm sure today and this week is a crazy week of work in all

[00:04:50] Phil: of the clubs.

Yeah, absolutely. And, and the transfers that were going to happen, like if Leeds got relegated, then would Calvin Phillips have gone to a different team? Maybe he still [00:05:00] will, but that changes. And I was talking to my son about it, you know, just the most lucrative game in all of global football is coming up this weekend with the championship, you know, playoff final.

And, and, but that game that you just watched yesterday, or, you know, the, the leads and the Burnley and that those. Just as you know, not just as, but pretty close as far as the amount of money, like you were talking about that they just staying up and then, every place, that's what I love about the premier league.

Every place you get, $2.2 million more for finishing. That one place ahead. So I think Leicester jumped three teams by winning yesterday. So they that's, you know, $6 million right there. They just, they just made, you know, so that's, that's, what's so great. Exactly. Well, Lester likes to make money in the premier league.

That's what, that's what they've been doing the last decade or so. But I love the story about that. I don't know if you heard that story about the Leicester fan that every year he put I think it was [00:06:00]$50 or 500. I think it was $50. He put down on Lester every year just to win the premier league.

The one year he did not because he was traveling was the year they won it. He would've made at 5,100 would have made over a hundred thousand dollars on that one bet. But he didn't work on that. Could you imagine? I just couldn't even imagine that, but anyway. What does that teach you about life and leadership?

Well, I don't know don't gamble, so that's not what we're saying. Cause I don't want people to take that from that. But anyway, there there's so much, it was just fun, man. What a fun day. I got to sit down with my kids and watch those games and to have them all on. I remember I just saw a post by Diego Bocanegra, our friend.

Five TVs and iPads and everything else in his room. And it was fantastic. And I just had the iPads and the TV. I didn't quite have the multiple televisions on mantels and stuff like

[00:06:51] Paul: he did, but he likes level though.

[00:06:53] Phil: He is the next level on everything he does. I think so. Anyway, but we we we've had a blast in our [00:07:00] house anyway, so, all right.

So let's get to it. We got, we got some some episodes to cover and we were. We were getting ready to start this episode. we'd mentioned, this was just a really cool half season. I mean, coming off of the, the off season talks and we, we had pumped up this, this season is having some really cool guests and may is mental health awareness month.

And so we were able to get folks on there who were, were going to help us understand mental health and, and all of them touched. Some were, that's all they talked about. Really. Boy. I just want to hear from you just generally over the last four episodes what are your thoughts?

[00:07:40] Paul: Yeah. And Phil, I feel like a broken record when we get on these, you know, half time, half time talks.

Cause I get, I get so much out of these interviews. You know, as a, as a former college coach and, and now doing the consulting work that I'm doing with different clubs and coaches and things, there's just so much out there so much more to continue to learn. And I just think some really fun programs and ideas that [00:08:00] are being pushed around our country in the world.

And I think these four guests that we have really dive deep into some really, really critical areas of sport. And I found them very, very interesting. Each and every one of them. And I think I told you, I'm going to go back to, you know, probably every one of them at some point to just kind of dig in a little bit deeper and listen a little bit more intently to some of the things that they're saying and it references.

They have to certain things. I think that can help me be a better leader in a, in a better coach and consultant as I'm navigating the things that I'm doing. Yeah.

[00:08:30] Phil: Yeah. I just, I was, I'm always blown away by our guests cause there's just so many people out there that are doing amazing things.

Just a lot, a lot of, I mean, I have tons of fun doing these interviews just because I get to learn stuff. But I remember actually it's kind of the funny stories about all these guests. They're all. Referrals or people that I've met over the last six to eight months. I mean, I, I, none of these, oftentimes these guests are people I've known for years and years, and that's one of the things I love about where [00:09:00] we've gotten to in this show as well, is that we're having people sending us guests.

We're having people that are saying, Hey, You should interview this person. You should interview that person. Daniel O'Neill the doctor the orthopedic surgeon who was the first guest of this season. He was from a friend of mine who said, Hey, I just heard this guy on another podcast.

You got to get them on yours. It's, it's exactly what you were talking about. And I mentioned that on that interview that he had listened to the Jay demerit interview my friend had, and he, then he listened to a different interview with Dr. O'Neill and he said, You got to, it's a psych the scene, they're talking about the same stuff you got to get them on.

And, and I'm so glad he did because what a, what a great conversation that was, you know, just to be able to talk with, with him about the idea of physical identity. And I've talked about that with so many people over the last, you know, ever since I just, I learned about him and and before we get into talking about that, I want to remind you folks out there, like.

Share with us, these guests, you now You can, you can just send me [00:10:00] an email and say, Hey, there's somebody that I know would be a great guest. Even if it's you, who you think would be able to share stuff with other people. We'd love to. We just want to, we're here to share really good information with people to be able to understand how we can use, you know, the lessons from this game and the lessons from other sports as well, to be able to help us in the different areas of our life.

So that's just a, you know, a. Plug for that. We, we do listen, we do respond to the emails. We do want to have these conversations with you. So, so going back to Dr. O'Neill, I mean, I, I know for me just to hear about the impact of. When we talk about U sports and how the, the very highly elite competitive sports in our country have changed and caused specialization, all these other things that we've talked a lot about on this show, he brought a different angle on it.

The idea that it also brings in the issue that when kids [00:11:00] don't play. The competitive sports. Now they're really dubbed as non-athlete, which then leads to them, you know, really not getting exercise and not being physically fit and physically active because it's athlete non-athlete distinction. It used to be non-athletes were.

Going out and still playing, riding their bikes around, climbing on trees, go into parks, hanging out, doing hikes, doing all these things. And now it seems like when you're a non-athlete, you're going and sitting on a screen and playing video games and, you know, sitting at parks rather than playing it parks, you know, that, that type stuff.

And, and I, and I I've seen it a little bit with. With just the high school kids. But what, what have you seen on that? I mean, do you, do you, is that, is that you, you see that in Waco, do you see that in the different when kids stopped playing the sports, are you seeing that same thing?

[00:11:54] Paul: Yeah, you do. And one of the, I mean, I really, I really liked a lot of the things that Dr.

Neil talked about, because I, I do [00:12:00] think that there, we've got to, we've got to push our education system to make sure that we're keeping physical fitness and keeping you know, not sport, but just. There's times, you know, there's so many studies and he talks about it. You know, the studies that talk about how academics are the more successful in academics when people are active, right?

Even our own minds that, Hey, wake up, get your, get your day going and get some exercise. Like it's the same thing for kids. And I think because of specialization and because of the high emphasis on high athletic achievement, I think, and, and with the Ongoing push for tech and the accessibility of tech for our kids.

It's easy for kids, not, not to do things, you know, when, when we were younger and there wasn't as much tech, I mean, we're just going to sit in our room all day and do it. What, look at our ceiling, you know, I mean, we could, but we did, if we weren't doing that, we were doing something active. We were moving our bodies to do things, and I think.

The push to get back into our education system, back into our schools, you know, physical activity and physical education. And I've seen it in some local local [00:13:00] schools where, a PE class is, is, they're just walking around a track. I mean, that's better than nothing. Right. But you know, how can we get our kids more active?

How can we introduce them to things? That, that keeps them active and keep them outside and keep them moving, moving their bodies and teaching more about how to take care of themselves. So I think that that's a really important thing that he's doing is that fight for Physical activity, even within our, in our school programs are getting parents more involved in the importance of challenging, you know, our kids to just get out and play.

You know, you guys talked a bit on the thing about think it's, is it safety as them? You know how sometimes, you know, a lot of parents are scared about their kids going out and playing and doing things. And I, I find myself at times too, having. My self of, you know, what I think might be okay for my kids to do and realize, okay, is that something really that I should be concerned about?

Or is that something that just kind of played into my head? And really, it shouldn't be much of a concern, you know? But I enjoyed his conversation and the conversation around specialization [00:14:00] that, you know, that's a, that's a theme that has come up a lot in our conversations through many, many guests is that specialization thing.

And I love, you know, you had the conversation with them, but. The whole conversation about specialization from his opinion was very interesting. Cause you were, you were dancing very well through like, Hey, you're not saying that, you know, high level sport is a bad thing, but, and you're not, you know, take me through kind of your thought process as you were interviewing him through that conversation of, of specialization.

Because I thought it was a very unique. Yeah,

[00:14:28] Phil: well, you know, his book and I, I, I strongly recommend that book survival of the fit and it, and it goes into a lot of these things and it is a dance and it is something that I wanted to make sure that he was sharing his views on competitive sports, because he's very clear that.

For that 1%, you know, kind of, we were talking about in the demerit interview for that 1%. Yeah. Go and do what you got to do, but the problem is we don't know who that no [00:15:00] 1% is no early on. And everyone's worked coaching. Everyone is if they're about 1%, because we don't know who the 1% is, which makes sense from that side of it.

Right. But as a parent, As a P as, as an orthopedic surgeon, he's seeing the detrimental effects of it. Coaching everyone to that 1%, when most people aren't the 1%, necessarily 99% of the people are not the 1%. Right. Exactly. You know, I can do some math, like even this early in the morning, So in the interview, I want to not lead him too much because I know I was a lawyer.

So I know you don't want to lead people too much, especially when you know what they're going to say generally, unless you're cross-examining, which I'm not doing in these, just to make it clear and yet I didn't want him coming across as this guy, you know, as he said, most of our audience are people who are going to be either coaching at high levels, playing at high levels, going to be playing at high levels, wanting people to play at high [00:16:00] levels.

But most people listening to this are going to have that competitive too. So I didn't want. Writing him off as some whack job who hates competitive sports. And I wanted people to make sure to really understand that because we're pouring so much into this. It's actually ruining a lot of the physical identity for these other kids.

Because as a society we've said that, oh, if kids want to be active, we have all these youth sports that are out. The problem is most of the kids are either burning out. They don't think they're good enough. And there's not a lot of options. Now. It used to be that there was recreational sports up until high school, high school was done where a YSO rec soccer.

And you could play at a decent level playing that. Now it's like everything is either club competitive or. Just nothing. I mean, there is, there are those games, but I've reffed those games. I don't know if you've seen those games. [00:17:00] Paul is painful. Yeah. It's like, it's literally parents who were saying it's probably to their kids.

You have to play something. You have to do something. You're not just going to sit around here, but good for those parents like to be like, you gotta be active, but the kids are out there and they just don't care. Yeah. And half the times you're showing up with nine players because the girls are not even wanting to be out there.

So, and I see it at the high school level too. So that's what I wanted to make sure with him. I was giving him the opportunity to share it and. Making sure people didn't write them off as some wacko, cause he's not at all. I mean, he's a guy who, I mean, not only is the orthopedic surgeon, who's just brilliant.

Obviously, if he's gonna make it through and doing all that, he's got that book on knee surgery too, which I recommend, but he also is a guy who, who really loves sports. I mean he does. I mean, he literally, I don't know if you saw it, but as I'm wrapping up that episode, if you watch the video, you'll see him literally walk by the video in a, [00:18:00] in a bike outfit, because he was, he went from straight from our interview to a big bike ride that he had with his people, because he's practicing what he's preaching, you know, and he's a guy who really believes this and he wants the people to continue playing sports at high level.

Also, he is, his heart is for that 75% of people who stopped playing sports before college and to make sure that they don't just stop being active. So anyway, then we can talk on and on about that, but that was that, that was that dance. That was that dance from,

[00:18:33] Paul: that was good. Yeah. And I think, I mean, there may be a transition there, you know, not skipping out of order.

Don't think the order matters if we talked about our guests, but I think there was a connection there. With Evan, you know, who's the executive director of the New Jersey youth soccer, which we can dive into that a little bit too. But I think there's a connection because he talks a little bit too in the women's game, how he's seeing a trend for women's.

Or girls not participating as much. So the numbers for participation for, for girls is [00:19:00] starting to lessen. Now. I think we did we hit a height after the, the 99 world cup. Right. And we kind of cruise the set. So maybe it's a leveling off a bit, but I think there's a piece of it there too, where it went from, there's an excitement about youth girls soccer to now it's specialization and it's playing at a high level, or you're not really going to play soccer anymore.

There's so many other things for, for people to do now. And maybe that's why those numbers are diving. So I think those do relate a little bit with our desks. That maybe, maybe part of the problem with, you know, maybe the drop a little bit of decline in the numbers for girls soccer has to do with the fact that we've really gone to the specialization on the girl's side from, you know, where girls could play a couple of different sports.

So now they're really special and if they want it, they want to go to college and I'm putting my quote fingers up for those. You're just listening to the audio. If they want to play college soccer, they have to specialize in. In soccer from the age of 10, it's not true. I don't believe I don't believe in it.

But maybe there's some correlation there between those two. And that's just one little bit of bitty, bitty minute thing [00:20:00] that Evan talked about, but I think that's a, maybe a bit of a connect.

[00:20:04] Phil: Yeah. You know, I, I talk, you, you do too. I know. And I'd love to hear your thoughts on it and see if you agree.

But you know, my, a big part of my theory is when they specialize early, the parents are also investing massive amounts of money and time into it. Right? So they're telling their kids, you're going to make it, you're going to be there. This is why we're doing it. We're pouring into you. We're investing in you so that you can be a.

College player probe, whatever the, whatever that next level is, they're trying to get to, you can be a comp player. If they're just playing rec, you know, when they're eight, nine, we're investing in you, we're getting you this. Private training. We're getting you the speed training. We're getting you the agility training.

We're going to have put a parachute on your back and you're going to run, we're going to do this. We're going to do that. Right. And, and I'm not saying that's bad. But it puts a lot of pressure on those kids. So to do in the right keep [00:21:00] perspective and doing that is really difficult. It's, it's it's tough to do that.

And so there's this pressure pressure, pressure. Then they get in. These clubs. And necessarily if you're going to have 20 elite players at a UC and L club or a memo less next or whatever it is, it's ton of pressure on these kids. And so this is pressure cooker, which we've talked about. Parents are also pressuring, but then also if their kid's not going to play all the time, which they want.

Because there's 20 kids on that elite team and all those are great players. If you have 20 to have to sit out in any given tournament, because you can only have 18 on the bench, right? So they're literally not even possibly playing in the game. So that causes a lot of, I mean, in less, the coaches are dialed in to culture and understand themselves and understand their players.

It leads to toxicity on those teams when there's toxicity on those teams, you and I we've talked a lot about this too. All of a sudden, it's just a recipe for burnout,[00:22:00] Which then you go to, why are so many young women and men? Both. It's not just the girls side. That's, that's burning out. Why are they all burning out?

Well, because they They're there in these toxic, terrible environments that are getting them and they're getting it from all, all sides. They're getting it from the parents. They're getting it from the coaches and they're getting it from their teammates too. Like, you gotta do this, you gotta do that.

You gotta do the next thing. And man, they're just trying to figure out who they are. Right. They're trying to figure out their identity. They're trying to figure out. What do I want to do next? And we're putting all this on them. And I, I just, I just think it's too much, which it's no wonder that the amount of girls who are still playing in high school is dwindling because they're also told if you're not the best, then why even bother.[00:23:00]

Right. I mean, do you agree with that?

[00:23:03] Paul: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And I think that there's just a, there's too much pressure on these girls at a young age. Or any player, men, women, whatever, too much pressure at a young age to, to do. And I, I think I've told this story before, where I've had numerous, numerous players come to the collegiate level that have their first realization being away from mom and dad.

That they don't even really love soccer. Right. You know, it's like, I've been playing forever saying, Hey, why, why do you play? Oh man, I've never really been asked that, you know? So I think that's a, it's definitely a thing. It's a trend that needs to change and go back the other way. Sure.

[00:23:38] Phil: Yeah. So I, I love, like you said, I love what Evan's doing there.

I love the, and you even talked about it before. I mean, I'd love to hear your thoughts on that. It's just as far as understanding what a state association actually does, like that was kind of cool.

[00:23:52] Paul: Yeah. I found it really interesting. And obviously I love the collaboration that, that the state associations, state associations have, that he talked about with some of the different [00:24:00] they in surgery.

Collaborating on, on things. Cause we, as a leader, we need to share information. We need to share it, especially if our goal is to benefit a certain population of people. So if we're trying to benefit young soccer players, then yes, those state association should work together to share knowledge and share information.

But it's amazing. And I, you know, I've been part of youth sports most my entire life, and don't think that I really truly understood. A lot of the things that go on inside of a state association. And I think he talked about having a team of maybe 10 people. I think he threw that in there dealing with like what a hundred thousand members or something like that.

So, it's amazing the things that they're doing and initiatives that they're pushing on to to support their community and right in every even mentioned that, you know, every community is going to be a little bit different. Every state's going to be a little bit different. And what their pursuit is and what their focus is going to be on.

But I think it is important that they understand the needs of their community and are, are pouring into that. And it sounds like he's doing a fantastic job in the state of New Jersey. I just keep [00:25:00]hearing a lot of great things coming out of the state, New Jersey and. I think that New Jersey has always kind of been ahead of the game when it came to youth soccer, they've always had, it talks about some of the players that come back to, or they're not players anymore, but former players that are coming back to pour into the community.

There's some, some big names that have come out of the state of New Jersey, men and women. So I think they've always done it at an elite level. And I think he's doing a great job of, of keeping that, keeping that.

[00:25:26] Phil: Yeah. It's funny. When you think about New Jersey, cause it's like Northeast cold, you know, like you don't think much about New Jersey as far as soccer, then you remember that Tony Meola tab, Ramos, Carli, Lloyd, and Carly.

Lloyd's one of the people think about all the time. Cause she is. Recent but age, but, but there's a lot of names that come out of there and, and it's, it's a, it's a great pool of great players and it has been historically and probably will continue to be. And, and that's, what's cool. So books, if you, if you didn't listen to that, go check out.[00:26:00]

He talks about the growing the girls' game initiative that they have. He talks about the innovate to grow initiative, that David Rica, who was also on the podcast, a few episodes back is heading up there. They had their Metro leagues. They have some, it's a lot of really cool stuff. As you said, Paul, a hundred thousand kids.

About 5,000 coaches and believe it's just a huge operation and Evan came from the MLS and he's just bringing some amazing stuff to a new Jersey's soccer. And so if you're in that area, you, you have a great, a great guy at the helm. If you're not, I think you got a lot to learn from it and talked about collaboration in that as well as he's collaborating with other state associations on some, you know, safety projects on some other things.

And hopefully we can start doing some more stuff with them collaboratively. That was a great great conversation. The other one that we got to talk with exits a friend, another mutual friend of David Rica who referred me to Cara Bradley. And all these, I think all but Daniel and Neil are, are connected in [00:27:00] this, in this half season.

But Kara, she talked about this gut brain connection, which was, you know, it's fascinating to me, just how the brain works, how the body works, the, the miracle of the body. Really that it all works together and it's all interconnected. And man, you can't do one thing without an effecting 25 different things or more in your body.

So what'd you think of that interview?

[00:27:21] Paul: Uh, It was fascinating. I think I mentioned to you before we started recording that, I've heard a bit about that, that gut brain connection and, and not enough to know anything. Her interview intrigued me to want to go in and learn more about it, you know?

And I think as she's talking and you start thinking through your own decisions through what you eat and how you exercise, you start putting, I started putting the pieces together in my own life. I'm like, oh, well, maybe that's why this, or that's why that or whatever, you know? So it does make a lot of sense when you start to, to navigate and put some pieces together.

But. I think she's just a wealth of knowledge and information and extremely, extremely smart and, [00:28:00] and the focus of what she's been doing and studying for life. And I love her. And then if for nothing else, go back and listen to the podcast, just to hear her story and how she got to where she is, was a very interesting road.

I mean, nothing real, crazy. Yeah. Sometimes you wonder how do people end up studying something so specific and so unique and her road to get there is worth the listen just on its own. But I do, I do like that gut brain health idea. And I think that as I'm navigating a little bit more use for it now, and some, you know, things like that, I think it's something that I'd like to know more about also as we're navigating how to keep players healthy and injury free and just long longevity of player it can be very.


[00:28:41] Phil: You know, and, and you kind of alluded to it, but the great thing about. Conversation is she talks a lot about optimal performance, right. And the idea of getting in the flow as I joked about on that. And, you know, I, I hope you'd brought you back to NBA jams, you know, like when I [00:29:00] go, you know, and you can't miss a shot, like.

There, how do you get to inflate? Maybe not with literal fire flames on your back, but you know, with the ball, you know, you don't want to burn boss, but, but it's, it's that idea of how do you get to that zone? We've all been. And how can we recreate that moment and not just have it be a thing, a chance. And so that's, you know, that was, that was what I, I just really enjoyed that conversation.

And then the gut brain is part of that. The, the, some of the other things that she's, that she talked about there again with the just mental health, it doesn't just mean going and meditating. You know, that may be part of it doesn't mean just doing breathing techniques may be part of it. It doesn't mean just, doing.

At their practice. So, you know, yoga or stretching or whatever, it's, it starts with what you eat. Right. And that starts, but it, it, it's what you eat as well. Right? That's, that's part of it. If you don't eat well, it's gonna, your brain will not be optimally healthy and you won't be able to perform [00:30:00]optimally.

And that doesn't mean just drinking some protein shakes and, you know, making sure your muscle mass is right. If you're not getting the right bacteria, your brain won't function at its highest capacity. And that is fascinating, you know? Totally. So, so that was another one. Any other, any other thoughts on.

[00:30:17] Paul: No. I mean, there's some other interesting pieces in there that people should listen for with her or inline skating or rollerblading career and her, you know, just some other interesting things. And I won't talk about it too much on here because I want to leave it for folks to, to navigate and find on their own within the interview.

But she's an interesting. Listen for a thousand different reasons.

[00:30:34] Phil: Absolutely. Absolutely. There, I think they call them Easter eggs. Is that what they call them? Like those Easter eggs that you find in the, in the videos or something out there. But anyway, that's what the kids talk about. Anyway. I don't know.

I'm not as hip

[00:30:46] Paul: as you felt.

[00:30:47] Phil: Yeah. Well, I'm, I'm not hippy either. Cause I I'm asking you. Cause you're there a few years younger. So that's why I'm trying to see if you, if you know, but your children

[00:30:56] Paul: a little bit older than, than mine, I think that's what keeps you connected.

[00:30:59] Phil: That's [00:31:00] true. That's true. Some sort of egg that you can find in these in these episodes.

So go check them out. We'd love to love to hear your fun. They are fun. They're fun. If I find that about someone I'm going to ask him. So I was able to do that with Kara and then the last, the last one we got to do together, what if, what a fun thing that was, man, I just really enjoyed. And, and hopefully we'll get to do more of that where we're, we're hopping on interviews together.

You brought so much different to the table that I wouldn't have asked. And just to your experience that you're, you're able to bring. So hopefully everyone else enjoyed that, that too. But what what'd you take out of that with Brad? Just, I know we talked about it during the interview a little bit more than we were able to do that on that interview, but just looking back on it. I know I listened to it again. I don't know if you were able to after the interview, but what'd you really just take away from that to give, give people a couple of nuggets from that interview so they can go back and listen to it?

[00:31:50] Paul: Yeah, I, I think, you know, obviously Brad is a, is a repeat interview, you know, he's been on before and I think the progress of soccer [00:32:00] resilience from when you first interviewed him, So when we get to interview him during this last season, it's always fun to keep up with our guests. And I think we'll probably do that with some others.

I'm sure. But just the things that they're doing and I've had since that first interview I had the chance to speak with Brad was at Baylor and we've kind of kept in touch. And I just find the work that they're doing with soccer resilience is, is so new. Right now not just collegiately, but through youth soccer and college soccer, pro soccer, they're getting all the levels.

And the way they've the system that they've put together and the way they're going about doing it is also very. You know, I've talked to many people over my career that are selling the next thing or whatever, and it's just not practical to put into, into place. So, I think not only what they're doing, but how they're doing it makes it very practical.

And I think also we talk a little bit about trying to get rid of the stigma of, of, of needing a counselor or a psychologist and the introduction of sports psychology and that sort of thing. But I think their, their goal to kind of eliminate the stigma of it and make it more [00:33:00] of a. Practical thing that we navigate as humans, not just as athletes, but specifically athletes in this context is, is is a much needed thing.

Especially as we're seeing everything, you know, recently with the recent suicides of student athletes that are coming, you know, gaining more and more national attention. You know, these are some things that these are resources. Are very practical to use and very well done. And those that's what I've taken away from, from what, what Brad's doing with soccer.

Resilience is just much needed and very practical ways of, of, of getting in with not just players, but players, coaches, and players, sorry, players, coaches, and parents which are all, you know, very unique situations within, within.

[00:33:43] Phil: Definitely. Yeah. I always enjoy talking with Brad. He's just a good dude.

He's just a really good dude. And he's, he's the real deal. He's he's in it. Like, like we are just to help people, you know, he wants to, he wants to help people to flourish and yeah, and I love it. Cause he actually reached [00:34:00] out to me again and was like, Hey. It's mental health awareness month. I love to be able to, you know, just share some, some different things.

And I, I really enjoyed your conversation with him from a practical standpoint for coaches and parents too. But, but man, the coach is just a what's that interaction look like, like ideally what's it look like and what it was the difference between a sports psychologist and a counselor. And when would you use one and what does it look like?

And what's the, how can we keep the, the The confidentiality that, that makes this necessary when we're doing this stuff, because we need to make sure to, to protect that. And otherwise people aren't going to share a lot of stuff. And if there's something that the coach needs to know to be able to help that player flourish at the higher level, how can they share that in a way that's appropriate?

What does that look like? And that tension again, I think that's, that's that that's similar, you know, we talk about tension and a lot of these different interviews, right. But that's the tough stuff. This stuff is nuanced, which is why I love being able to talk about it. Here [00:35:00] is we can talk about it in a kind of a neutral setting for people where there's not a particular person.

In the frame where, you know, there's all these different variables. We can talk about it in the abstract and then the different variables obviously put it in that context and see what it looks like. But I, I really appreciated how, how Brad really just laid it out and made it very clear. He does that very, very well.

So I, I just love talking with him about that and

[00:35:27] Paul: yeah, and I would encourage to, we talked a little bit about, you know, being, old-school type of coaches that, you know, maybe. You know, the sports psychology thing is kind of a new thing, you know, in some ways it's kind of a new thing. And there's, a lot of coaches that have the old, an older mentality that they, they themselves don't know how to respond to or accept kind of this, how this is kind of moving forward and how, how needed it is.

And I would just encourage any coaches that may be. Both of, you know, not, not really sure what this is or what it's about, or if it's even [00:36:00] necessary. I encourage you to listen to this podcast because I think like you said, Brad does a really good job of putting some of those things into perspective for us as we're going.

Cause I even admit that, you know, early on in my coaching career, I wasn't so sure about all of it either, but I think when you adopt it and you realize how important it is it can really benefit not only yourself, but your players. And yeah.

[00:36:22] Phil: Absolutely. Absolutely man. Well, Hey, so I mean, I hope you're going to, did you enjoy that?

Are you like a one and done or you like saying I'm going to, I'm going to do more of the interview. Let's do some more. All right.

[00:36:35] Paul: Sure. I mean, I really enjoyed, those conversations and I think that, I think one thing I enjoyed about it is, you know, you and I are similar in a lot of ways, but our perspective and experience within the game is very different.

So I think we were able to ask them. Uh, Directed questions that, especially with Brad's interview, that was, I think, hopefully helpful for a wide variety of listeners that we have on the podcast.

[00:36:57] Phil: I figured as much I figured I just didn't want to make [00:37:00] assumptions.

I just didn't want to make assumptions there. So now I absolutely loved it. And I think that everyone out there did as well. So hopefully we can, we can do more interviews with the two of us being able to do it. and you can do some interviews with yourself. With people other than your wife.

So that will be, that will be good. So we'll see. We'll see. I don't know. I'm just, I'm just, I'm just the aspirations, you know, but all right. So as we, as we close up another half time show, what are, what are your you know, just kinda just, what are you thinking, man? What are you thinking about this this half season?

What are you thinking about moving forward? What are you thinking about? Just what excites you about what's going on with.

[00:37:37] Paul: Well, I think we're in a really cool place with this podcast. First of all, I mean, you, you announced her this week 20,000 downloads, and obviously we're, we're making an impact, which is why we're doing this.

We're doing it to help people and help, you know, help others. And I'm just, you know, what I get excited about during this halftime is what's next, what's next? What's coming in the next half season here. What are we going to be bringing to the table for [00:38:00] these folks and for ourselves selfishly, right?

Because we're helping others and helping ourselves through this process. But I think it's very important that we sit back and look at this past month, you know, being, you know, mental, mental health awareness month and how important it is that we not just. Get through this month and then kind of forget about it.

I think it's important that we're navigating not only for ourselves as leaders and coaches, because we have to take care of ourselves first. And then once we're able to do that, we can, we can help our, our athletes as well. So I don't want to look past what this month was all about. And I thought he did a good job of putting together four episodes that really dove into what can make us better as leaders through, through those actions.

[00:38:36] Phil: Well, I am looking forward to the next half as well. There are some great interviews coming your way. We're actually working on a couple to finish off the half. We have two common one is a very diverse, I'm not even going to say what it is, but it's just a different, it's a different interview with you know, it's got, it's actually two, two men I talk with.

One is a soccer guy. The other is not, and he's [00:39:00] very different from what you'd expect on a soccer podcast, which is. Back to where we're all about leadership here. And if we can learn from other sports other disciplines, I'll give you a hand it's it's, it's related to a, a sport. We've talked about a few times and actually I have a couple of recommendations about on the show already.

So that just gives you a little teaser there. And then the other one is actually another uh, mental health conversation with Shea hat out. she's a great woman. Who's doing some cool things. So we're going to talk about. Talk with her as well. and so I also just want to remind you folks, we got, we got coaching in the bigger game that is now out there.

You're able to sign up for that. If you want to do that, coaching the bigger again, that's to help lead yourself, lead your individual players and lead your team with excellence. And Paul has warrior way, where you can find everything you want to know about where your way, where your a gives, where your way consulting.

Some really cool. Going on there. You know, no, Paul just got back from [00:40:00] Spain doing some cool stuff. So we'll probably talk about that in the future. What's, what's coming down the pike for him and with that organization. So with all of that folks, I hope that you are taking what you're learning from this show and you're using it to help you be a better leader in every way, a better spouse, a better parent, a better friend and your community, and a, and you're continually reminding yourself that soccer does explain life and leads.

Thanks a lot, have a great week.